scouts-l Mail Archive for November of 1999: Re: No Confidence Vote
Darryl Hammill (darryl.hammill@NCMAIL.NET
Wed Nov 10 1999 - 08:28:36 CST
Perhaps an update is required at this point.
1) Calmer heads have prevailed (mine especially). There is no desire to have a no
confidence vote. Thanks in large part to the wonderful advice and opinions shared
in this venue.
2) The SM has done a tremendous job in three years. Advancement and leadership
3) This is shaping up to be more of a personality conflict that anything else/.
4) The young man mentioned in the original post is now the Troop's Chaplain's
Aide. He had a grin from ear to ear on Monday night when he heard the news, and I
think he'll do a good job. THis is his first leadership position.
5) We will begin a tradition of singing/saying Scout Vespers before we break camp
on every campout or outing.
6) I pointed out to the Dad mentioned that I took his concerned seriously. That I
was indeed listening. And that I would do my best as Committee Chair to help
improve the Troop. But, I also took the opportunity to point out how far we have
come since we were founded three years ago. And that while I wanted him and his
Son to be happy and comfortable that my job as Committee Chair was to be sure
that the SM was doing what was best for the entire group. He pointed out that
perhaps from my perspective the glass was 1/2 full, while from his vantage point
it was 1/2 empty. We agreed to work together on filling up the other 1/2 of that
7) The Dad has volunteered to:
a) Begin a series of 10 minute classes for the scout leaders in leadership
There are about 10 points that if they do these, they will be better scouts,
better humans, better students, etc. Let them pass the points on then to
b) Incorporate Pride building exercises into the Monday meetings. e.g.. have
the scouts buy a new flag pole and finnial. I'll supply the money. Have them
assemble things that are delightful to show off.
c) Incorporate formal continuous improvement analysis into the troop
operations at both the scout level and the committee level.
d) Stress the importance of good meeting management. On time, etc. Make
e) Have fun! But be inclusive. This takes some planning and care.
f) Teach older scouts how to mentor younger scouts. some already do well,
others do not. They need to be taught. Hold mentoring classes. Short but
I realize that what he is offering sounds so business like, but that is this
dedicated Dad's style. The good news if that Dad is SMF trained and was A Webelos
leader. I also suspect that even with the training he has in him a top down
management style - while we all know that Scout Run means bottom up.
I guess the lesson to learn from this is to take matters such as this serious -
but to not jump to conclusions or allow the "heat of the moment" to take control.
I am still concerned that Dad and Scout have never approached the SM about this.
Maybe over some time they'll realize that SM is a good guy, hard worker, SMF and
soon Wood Badge trained, and truly dedicated to the Troop and to Scouting. He
tries very hard to put a good program in place for all the Scouts.
Best wishes and thanks to all who helped me and the Troop.
Dale Karweik wrote:
> The scenario raised by Darryl Hammill is too vague to offer a direct
> answer. The fact a single boy is uncomfortable in speaking with the SM is
> not an atypical situation. Some personalities just don't click when put
> together. However, another posting implied that help outside the Troop
> was immediately essential in dealing with the problem. I disagree. This
> answer would be correct if a youth protection issue was involved but only
> the parent's questioning of the SM's character was cited, no other issues.
> Ther are some things I think need to be done first within the unit.
> Privately talk with the Committee members who do Boards of Review. Have
> ther been any indications of problems in the past? Is there any history of
> boys leaving the Troop with vague reasons? Is there a problem in general
> in advancement which can be attributed to lack of SM conferences? If the
> answers are no, then this is an individual's problem and should be handled
> as such. If the answer is yes, then you need to start looking for a new SM
> if a word to the wise will not correct the situation.
> Some parents find it very easy to blame the SM for their sons' lack of
> motivation or success. I would rather have an active parent transfer to
> another unit with the Scout than lose both the SM and the Scout later. If
> there is a YP situation, get outside help. It is the policy of the Council
> I am in to take care of those situations officially so they do not
> re-occur. I believe this is also national policy. This requires outside
> assistance from your Council. If there is no YP situation, then the
> situation should be handled within the unit and should be handled
> privately. The rule that you praise in public and correct in private
> should apply to adults as well as the Scouts.
> Dale Karweik
> Troop 417 Scoutmaster Emeritus and ASM
> Buckeye District Boy Scout RT Commissioner
> Post 214 - Black Sheep OA Dance Team and Construction Crew - Advisor
> Always an Eagle - EC430 Frenetic Fox
> | >>>----|>---->| Aminga Klockauchsowagon (Teller of Long Legends)