Scouts-L Mail Archive for August of 1999: Re: I'M WRONG re: parent camping
Re: I'M WRONG re: parent camping
Thu, 5 Aug 1999 13:57:23 -0400
Chuck Bramlet wrote that he took exception to Jim Peterson's Troop policy.
I don't believe that Jim's policy would work for my Troop, but the bottom
line is that it does work for him. One the great things about Scouting is
the variety of Troop styles that exist within the program. Troop leaders
have described the full range of only three leaders are allowed on a camp
out to every adult is expected to be a leader and the more leaders the
better. I am somewhere in the middle. I believe that a certain critical
mass of active leaders (and I am not addressing the weight issue :-) ) is
necessary for a successful Troop operation, but too many generate more
politics than useful work. This balance works for my Troop, probably won't
for another. I have read about the Troop with backpack only equipment and
those that bring the kitchen sink. Again, use the style that works for
you. Chuck is correct in saying that we have to stay within the rules, but
generally this allows for a great deal local diversity which makes one unit
more desirable over another and may keep a youth in the program longer.
Keeping a boy in the program long enough to allow him to grow up to be a
responsible, reliable citizen is my bootom line.
At 10:22 AM 8/5/99 -0700, CHUCK BRAMLET wrote:
>Jim Peterson writes...
>>Gotta dissagree with you on this one. Our troop has the most
>>stringent policy with regard to leader training and participation
>>AND we have one of, if not THE highest levels of parent involvement
>>and percentage of leaders per scout in our district. Our troop
>Of course you have, because if the boy wants to be in your Troop,
>one of his parents _must_ register and take the time. How many boys
>do you lose because they have single parents who don't have extra
>time to do this? How many parents do you have that, deep down, feel
>the policy is unreasonable, but go along with it so their boy can
>have the Scouting experience. How many other Troops are there in
>your local area?
>_I_ certainly feel that the policy is unreasonable.
>>policy states that if you want to attend camping activities with the
>>troop you must register, attend SM Fundamentals (a two weekend, two
>>weeknight course), attend troop meetings regularly. The ONLY
>Sorry, Jim, your Troop policy is _flat_wrong_. It may not be against
>regulations per se, but that doesn't meant that you are doing things
>I have no problem requiring each Scout's family to help the Troop at
>least _once_ during the year, either by driving, or serving on the
>Troop Committee or a subcommittee. But the rest is horse biskits!
>Not everyone is equipped to be SM. Not every one who is is a good
>one. Not everyone can be a good committee chair, outdoor chair,
>activities chair, or even ASM or MBC.
>One of our Wood Badge skills is "knowing and using the resources of
>the group." If you are building a field stone wall it's not desirable
>to have all the stones the same size and shape. You need different
>sizes and shapes to give the wall its character. The same with
>adults. Not everyone is capable of doing the same job in the same
>way. You use their talents in the way that they can best help, not
>the way you _want_ them to help.
>Your exceptions remind me of a college professor I had one year who
>bragged that he had only given one incomplete - to a young man dying
>of cancer. He refused to allow make up or an incomplete to another
>student who lost his father in another state, and missed an important
>assignement and test while dealing with the estate.
>>2. The more training one gets, the more respect they have for the
>>program and the more interested they become in being PERSONALLY
>>involved in delivering the promise.
>_HA!_ One of the biggest troublemakers for me in my Troop is a man
>who has been to SMF, and believes that _we_ can still change the
>rules if we want to.
>>3. Training makes them more confident and successful at being good
>>leaders. Everyone wants to be successful.
>Again, wrong. In my experience, you have some people who will never
>be _good_ leaders, no matter _how_ much training they recieve. One
>of them is typing this. I'm too much of a "lone wolf". That's why I
>direct my efforts to RT and places where I can be an example
>_to_the_leaders_, and use my skills there, rather than try my
>leadership skills that are inadequate with boys.
>>Success breeds success.
>And oppresive rules are still oppresive rules.
>Chuck Bramlet -- I "used to be" an Antelope! WEM-10-95 Member DNRC
>ASM Troop 323, Firebird District, Grand Canyon Council, Phoenix, Az.
>The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of
>comfort and convenience, but where he stands in times of challenge
>and controversy. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.
>Please direct personal replies to ----- mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org
Troop 417 Scoutmaster Emeritus and ASM
Buckeye District Boy Scout RT Commissioner
Post 214 - Black Sheep OA Dance Team and Construction Crew - Advisor
Always an Eagle - EC430 Frenetic Fox
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