Thanks Re: Woodbadger's LONG question
Gary Calvert (c23glc@KOCRSV01.DELCOELECT.COM)
Thu, 12 Oct 1995 14:06:53 -0500
Sorry to post a "generic" thank you, but I can not find a way
to adequately reply to all the individuals who sent replies.
I would like the thank all those kind Woodbadge trained Scouts
and Woodbadge Staff Scouts who sent me E-mail, replied on the Net,
and even the phone call I missed while at a Shrine club meeting:
(another way to help kids)
Many of the replies I received were very well worded with a good
deal of thought put in to them. I got no "off-the-cuff" remarks. :-)
It should be noted that while I couldn't take up lots of space on
the Net with a Huge post with all the answers, I am posting a
summation of what I have had as a response to my questions.
_My_ interpretations of answers.
* Does the Woodbadge training leave the trained Leaders with the
goal of setting up Scout Units by simulating the training that
they themselves just went through by essentially placing the
Scout Leaders as the Woodbadge trainers and having the Scouts
meld into cohesive patrol units simply by having been placed
into the roll of Woodbadger?
No - Seems that the Woodbadge trained and Woodbadge staff leaders
who were on this particular summer camp may have gotten in
a comfortable roll of Woodbadge training and didn't take
the training and APPLY it, but instead emulated it with
* The impression I have of the Woodbadger's who were trained and
the Woodbadge trainers on the campout was that the effort was
to leave the Scouts to struggle at each task as a group and
through some "miracle" or "awakening" they would after a few
days become a functioning unit. Is this true?
No - This seems to be ONE way of teaching scouts, but if they do
not have enough knowledge and not "coach" as in Woodbadge this
particular method my not be successful. So increased involvement
of the Adult Leaders may be needed to encourage older scouts to
help the younger scouts.
* Should I have went ahead and given one on one assistance to the
boys to get them on there way to working as a patrol? (group
No - I concede that the better direction would to have had an older
scout (perhaps a JLT trained scout) to work with the patrols.
If there had been no older scouts who could have addressed the
difficulties, then it may have been appropriate.
* As good as Woodbadge appears to be, don't they teach tolerance and
sharing skills and information with others?
Sort-of-sometimes - The answers varied somewhat on this particular
question. Some were that the "Woodbadge experience" was necessary
to be able to understand. Some were that part of the Woodbadge
was to sharing skills and information. Anyhow I guess maybe it is
a function of the fraternal closeness of the local group. Answers
seemed to generally discourage the "fraternal secrecy" and to
encourage openness, but everyone still acknowledges a certain amount
of fraternal atmosphere around what is shared and varies from local
group to group.
* Do other non-Woodbadge Scouter's find themselves in an excluded
atmosphere, where information is shared only among Woodbadger's?
Sometimes - similar to the previous answers, depends on the people
and their fraternal closeness of the local group.
* I have been told that some adults taking Woodbadge never become
a working patrol. Do these people fail because they lack the
collective camping, Scouting skills, and foresight to see how a
patrol system is to work?
Sometimes - again depending on the coaches/counselors during a Woodbadge
course, a floundering patrol could find it is not successful if the
coaches/counselors are not effective in their "guided discovery"
methods of learning. Seems this is a more affective method for a
week long course than a multi-weekend course. The method has a
certain dependency upon the patrol getting "close" to each other
and understanding each others potential and short comings for
patrol activities and some familiarity or "closeness" is lost during
the week for weekend sessions.
* I can understand the camaraderie between Woodbadger's and a certain
amount of "insider" activity, but should that include what should
be shared for the better good of the Boy Scouts?
No - was the answer in general, but with the same caveats as the other
Thanks again to all who posted, emailed, and called.
I would encourage who ever keeps the SCOUTS-L files to gather some of
the answers and questions to keep in a file that can be retrieved from
the server. Like, a BSAWB file of some kind. Maybe with some of the good
Woodbadge resources in it. SORRY didn't mean to blaspheme! :-)
I would recommend that as much as possible any useful information be
made to all Scouters.
ANY help to the leaders is a benefit for the scouts they lead and
holding back information (even if just a philosophy of teaching that
needs to be experienced) will put your fellow scouters at an
necessary disadvantage when it comes to helping to work towards a
If they don't know the objectives and the desired methods they "ain't
gona be no help" to the scouts or other leaders if their efforts are off
in another direction.
I believe that anyone who will be taking would not be dissuaded because
they got a peek ahead of time at some of the goals, philosophies, and
resources of the Woodbadge courses.
They attend because they wish to experience the Woodbadge course.
They get involved with scouting as genuinely active and interested
Scout Leaders to better themselves in order to do what it is they
joined a leaders to do, help the young scouts.
Scouts Leaders will step up to the Woodbadge courses just as they always
have with that burning desire to pass along what they have learned and
to see the young scouts have fun while learning and experiencing the
Sorry to see there is a controversy over a WWW site that has the Woodbadge
leadership skills publicly available. I don't currently have access to
the WWW sites. Can't wait to get there later on. ;-)
I still plan on taking a Woodbadge course, but maybe out of council just
to get a different experience than the local folks.
I won't be able to get there till '97, my son has been an active Eagle
for 2 years and I still enjoy participating in campouts with him and the
troop. After he moves on, I will increase my personal participation in
the troop and council activities.
Scouting.... continuing with the morals and principals that America is
It is the way it is, because, it is what it is.
If you don't like it, go get your own federal charter, don't change the B.S.A.!
My best wishes to all in Scouting.
I used to be..... a lot younger. Where was that $.05 coke?
Gary Lee Calvert WB9SMX
A.S.M. Troop 568
P.O. Box 6353, Kokomo, Indiana 46904-6353
Work Internet = firstname.lastname@example.org
Home Ph 317-452-1314
Terry Howerton Sakima Group, Inc. SCOUTER Magazine Kansas City