Re: Eagle Adv. Question
Chris Haggerty, Sierra Vista, Arizona (CHAGGERTY@ARIZBPA.BITNET)
Thu, 14 Jul 1994 19:41:00 MST
Caution, long post (two 8.5x11 pages)
I am going to give you my opinions based upon my experiences and
the Advancement Guidelines, Council, and District Functions and of
course the requirements stated in the BSA Handbook. If you want
follow up discussion, please feel free to E-mail me direct, I will
be going to the Pimaree in Mexico Saturday and will not be back
until Thursday, at which time I am flying back to Michigan for my
20 year H.S. Reunion. I will return on the 31st, I will probably
have the No-mail option set to as to not overfill my account.
>Can a young man receive the Eagle rank even though he did not
>actually complete his Eagle Project?
The requirement reads (BSA Handbook): "While a Life Scout, plan,
develop, and give leadership to others in a service project helpful
to any religious institution, any school, or your community. The
project idea must be approved by your Scoutmaster and troop
committee and approved by the council or district before you
start." (The 1993-95 requirements book adds): "You must use the
Eagle Scouts Service Project Workbook, No. 18-927, in meeting this
This says nothing about having to "COMPLETE THE PROJECT". The
Advancement guidelines does imply this though because it says (page
15 - 1993 printing) Upon completion of the project, the Eagle Scout
Service Project Workbook, No 18-927, properly filled out, is
submitted with the Scout's Eagle application to include the
following information: ... "
It then says: ... The board of review must determine the manner
in which the project was carried out. Questions that must be
addressed include: ... "Was the project of real value to the
religious institution, school, or community group?"
I take that to mean we are looking for some value from the project
which also implies that it must be completed. In this case, what
good is a flag pole laying on the ground next to a hole in the
ground. Read page 1 of the Eagle Scout Service Project Book where
it talks about "After Completion" for more ideas on what is being
My personal answer (I have no idea if National has an answer
because they do not state it - something I am sure they do on
YES he can receive his Eagle without completing his project. READ
THE REQUIREMENT AS STATED - it says nothing about completing it -
does however stress PLAN, DEVELOP, and LEADERSHIP. If these are
missing, it's a no go. Would I say yes for an uncompleted Eagle
Project, yes, but it would have to be a real good reason and I am
not sure this example qualifies in my book.
I do not know all the details so it is hard to determine this from
where I am at, but based upon the information provided this would
be my reaction.
>Can his Eagle Project be completed without the boy actually
NO, but that does not mean he has to be doing the work. He has
contact with the scoutmaster and I would assume his mother (no
mention was made of her). He can get them to announce the dates
to complete the work have one of them direct the completion of the
work. I would prefer that the young man was present while the work
was being completed, I see no reason why having him present as HIS
CHURCH (or is it just a local church?) working on this project
would be a problem. If protective services were really concerned
about the kid, they would not be cutting him off from his friends
(which he should be able to phone and get out to work), they would
make an effort to get him there and back, taking the necessary pre-
cautions to assure the youth is not followed by the father or
someone who would tell the father where the child is. If he does
get to call people to help (New friends from his new school - could
be more dangerous, they could be followed and used as sources) he
should use a pay phone not near his current residence (to avoid
caller ID phones).
The bottom line to me here is did he show LEADERSHIP in carrying
out the project? If he has to do this through the Scoutmaster then
so be it, but the leadership MUST BE THERE - THAT IS WHAT THE
PROJECT IS ALL ABOUT. Remember the Eagle project is not really about
WORKERS it is about LEADERS.
I suggest you discuss this with the other District Advancement
Chairmans and the Council Advancement Chair and find out their
feelings. If a problem does come out of it, they will be in the
thick of it in the appeal process and if you can find things which
will satisfy them, you will head off problems latter.
On a personal note: WHY DO WE ALWAYS SEEM TO PUNISH THE VICTIMS
MORE THAN WE PUNISH THE OFFENDER?
Chris Haggerty, Advancement Chairman, Cochise District,
Catalina Council, Sierra Vista, Arizona
Why are all the problems I see related to youths getting Eagle
based upon ADULT POLITICS and ADULT RELATED PROBLEMS, maybe we
should just get out and leave the program to the kids!
Terry Howerton Sakima Group, Inc. SCOUTER Magazine Kansas City